Talk:Timeline of Ermarian

Eye on apocrypha

I've been digging through dumps looking at the timeline and have noticed some disturbing things. They mostly concern the Emperor-list and other artifacts of that era.

First, is it ever stated in the games that there were THREE Hawthornes? I thought it was, but now that I look, I can't find it anywhere. If there were only two, the infamously hard-to-reconcile line from VoDT about Emperor Stewart's 80-year-old proclamation would be easy to reconcile. That would bring the school's closing dates in line with the other comments in that scenario, which range from "decades ago" to "about a century ago" but none of which approach the 125 years it currently claims.
Extermination of non-humans. First, and most importantly, the games give the impression that this was a constant thing; maybe there were some specific campaigns, but the article and timeline should reflect this. Second, E3 and A3 state "the Empire wiped all the giants off the surface a century ago." I'm willing to give that some wiggle room, but 550 years is a bit much!
Similarly, although the settlement of Valorim began at approximately the time the history section claims, it didn't extend to all of Valorim until circa 813 IE, so the dates listed for it are rather misleading.

If I've missed anything, or if there are any other objections, let me know. Otherwise, I'm editing the timeline to conform to game canon, and marking the articles in question as needing working. --- Slarty 13:42, 20 October 2006 (PDT)

I thought so too, and it makes sense that way - 1 sent the first expedition, 2 exiled people, and 3 mass-exiled people.
The article refers to Pralgad, not all of the Empire. Aizo still had giants.
Yeah, this change is fine.

--Drakey 18:15, 20 October 2006 (PDT)

I still can't find any evidence for a third Hawthorne. It makes sense either way, really, but canon seems to contradict his existence.

One new question: The A3 intro says the portal to Upper Avernum was made 5 years after the war ended, which would be 829. A3 also says it was completed 2 years ago. That would put A3 in 831 instead of 833. I assume the 833 date is from the game clock, so we can write this off as off-by-one errors. Can someone confirm that? --- Slarty 10:42, 21 October 2006 (PDT)

Dating Research

Discovery of the Caves

It was discovered by Empire magicians several centuries ago. (E3 - Book)
It was discovered by Empire magicians several decades ago. (A3 - Book)

Time between Discovery and Expedition

You haven't learned of the Visitation yet? When those above found these caves, they sent a large force below (E1, A1 - Motrax)
Many years ago, when these caves were

first found, the tyrants above sent down a variety of troops (E1, A1 - Linda)

First Expedition

It was thought that the First Expedition from the Empire about fifty years ago was the first group of humans to explore these caves (A1 - Tomb of Drath)
The ghost wears armor bearing the insignia of the Empire army. The armor is very old-fashioned. Nobody has worn armor like that for over a hundred years (E1, A1 - Ursula)
The dead soldiers before you wear the armor of the Empire, but at least a century old (E2, A2 - Mertis Spiral)
According to the Ancient Crypt in A1, the First Expedition was about 50 years prior to the events of A1, which happened in 817 IE. This puts the date of the First Expedition around 767 IE. The Kingdom of Avernum was established only nine years later in 776 IE. Arch-Mage Solberg 20:16, 5 November 2011 (PDT)

Time between Expedition and Exile

Arrogance, mostly. They split up to explore. The dragon Motrax killed some. Sliths others. Some just starved. The Empire decided that it was lethal down here. That's when it started exiling people to these caves. (A1 - Patrick)
This First Expedition was slaughtered to a man and woman. Later, the Empire had the idea of using Exile as a dumping ground for 'undesirables (E3, A3 - Book)

Exile

No direct comments whatsoever about when Exiling began, or how long there was between that time and the arrival of Micah and the Five. We do know that some of the exiled magi helped work on the portal to Exile before being exiled.

Early Avernite History

We found Exile to be a string of filthy caves, filled with scum-encrusted, beleaguered humans fighting desperately for survival. One of them, named Micah, was trying to bring order, but not having much luck (E3, A3 - Erika)
Once I fought. Then I built... I was one of a group of magi who formed this society, who made it possible. To make it possible, we first had to defeat the demon Grah-Hoth (E1, A1 - Patrick)
When humans first arrived in Avernum, Grah-Hoth was already here. He is a duke of the dark realms, but for reasons we never determined, he lived in our world. For Avernum to be ours, we

had to fight him (A1 - Micah)

They imprisoned the demon Grah-Hoth who ruled the caverns, and formed a nation (E3, A3)
The book lists 'Those who died to defeat Grah-Hoth.' It is a long list of names, and the dates of their deaths. You don't recognize any of the names. They all died around forty years ago, roughly the time of the founding of

Avernum. (A1)

The Castle was built very early in the history of Avernum. When Micah (soon to be Avernum's first king) led a force to take the Great Cave from the savage slithzerikai, he called for this fortress to be built in the very center
It covers the forty years of Micah's rule (A1)
He's the king now, and has been for over twenty years (A3, not E3 - Erika)

A4

Garzahd, the commander of the Empire army that invaded Avernum decades ago
About sixty years ago, before the war with the Empire, King Micah decreed that a new city be built here to house the new exiles from the surface.

Hawthornes

I want to assassinate King Hawthorne. It would be a good start. It was his father who sent me down here, and he who accelerated the pace at which people were exiled. (E1, A1 - Erika)
Our blessed Empress and ruler, Prazac the Kind and Just, was born in Y.E. 5420 (E3, A3 - Book)
General Gabor Krizsan, Dervish Field Commander. Ironically enough, he was one of the Empire's greatest generals. Won so many battles he had a province named after him. This made him very popular.""So much so that the Emperor at the time had him assassinated. Despite having loyally served the Empire all his life. His whole family got exiled to Avernum. (A2 - Mariann Kriszan, about her grandfather)

CONCLUSIONS:

No evidence for more than two Hawthornes
Unclear who was ruling at the time of the First Expedition

Extermination of magical creatures

Like the humans down here, my kind have been victimized savagely by the evils of the Empire. Their Emperor Hawthorne (now happily deceased) decided that the surface should be purged of magical creatures. (ZKR - Aeriassa the unicorn)
CREATURES OF LEGEND - The merciful and powerful Empire has ridded the Earth of many sorts of evil, verminous creatures. The foul Dragons, the Troglodytes, and soon the Nephilim are all examples of dark forces the Empire has completely wiped out.This book exists to describe these creatures and their sinister deeds, so that we may never forget the Empire's benevolence. We start with the Troglodytes, sinister humanoids who once actually roamed our lands (E3, A3 - Book)
Although the Empire did its best to cleanse the surface of anything wild or dangerous, and were, as far as we know, successful, many bizarre and fascinating creatures, such as 'birds' and 'clams' and 'bushes' still exist and thrive (E3, A3 - Book by Eva)
The Empire has done a good job of exterminating goblins and other foul creatures. They are usually only found in the wildest, most remote areas (VODT - Outside)
it's a troglodyte. This is very strange. They were said to be extinct (E3, A3 - Encounter)
the Empire wiped all the giants off the surface a century ago! What's one doing here (E3, A3 - Encounter)
A basilisk caught me unawares.""They're extinct aboveground. (E1, A1 - Ursula)
Now the Empire hunts them for sport (E2 - Caitlin, about Sliths)
You find the charred remains of a pile of dead giants, incinerated by Empire wizards. Empire soldiers must have attacked this house and killed everyone inside. The Empire's policy of ruthlessly eradicating the humanoid races continues (A2 - Encounter)
The pits contain dead sliths, hundreds of them, covered in a thin dusting of lime. They've all been brutally killed. There can be little doubt of who is responsible for this massacre. The Empire is doing down here what they did on the surface. They are slaughtering all non-humans (A2 - Encounter)
The Empire's campaign against non-humans races has been vicious, thorough, and successful (A3 - Encounter)
The Empire was determined to purge the world of all that was different or dangerous (E3, A3 - Anaximander)

Dragons

Before you came to Avernum, you didn't think any dragons still existed in the world. The Empire tried hard to slaughter them all, just like they wiped out every other magical creature on the surface, everything from gremlins to gryphons (A1 - Cave of Motrax)
_Because, in those times, the Empire hunted to extinction all manner of magical creatures, including dragons. With great success (A4 - Sleater)
The Empire hunted and slew most of us. Few of those left are capable of breeding anymore (E3, A3 - Athron)
The Empire killed all of the dragons centuries ago (A3 - someone in Dorngas)
I have been down here for centuries, long before the Empire commenced their savage genocide against my kind. (A1 - Motrax)
A thousand years I have been alive. I hope for a thousand more. (A1 - Motrax)
We are not hatched from like broods... They are all young, compared to me (A1 - Motrax, on siblings)

Nephilim

Most of the Empire has been exterminating Nephilim on the surface for a long time. More merciful governors have been rounding the cat people up and dumping them into Avernum (A1 - Anastasia's journal)
The Nephilim are a race of feline humanoids. Once common on the surface world, they have been hunted to near extinction, although some now remain in Exile (Race description)
On the surface, the Empire has been slaughtering them. Either that, or sending all of them down here. They won't be content until every nephil is dead (A2 - someone in Silvar)
Nephilim are feline humanoids, fierce and tribal. The Empire mostly eradicated them from the surface. The survivors are all down in Avernum (A4 - Encounter)
Because the humans of the Empire were so determined to purge the surface of our kind, and of all magical creatures. So many nephilim were hunted and slain by them, and the rest had their lands stolen and were sent to this pit (A4 - Mrrah)

after Prazac

You know how the Empire was towards non-humans."He shakes his head. "Some sent to Avernum. The rest slaughtered. I think it was a shame. Some of them were hostile, but the rest just wanted to live their lives. But the Empire? All non-humans were in for it then.""Much better, if you ask me. Since Empress Prazac came to power, non-humans have actually been tolerated. That's why you can be here without everyone shouting to hang the nephil (A3 - Inn of Blades)

--- Slarty 10:42, 21 October 2006 (PDT)